Comments on: Activism Success: Metrolink Riders Convince Board to Put Off Fare Hikes http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/ Covering Los Angeles's livable streets movement Tue, 07 Feb 2012 14:06:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: DJB http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-50151 DJB Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:55:36 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-50151 Haha, guess I need to learn more about what's going on out there. I'm glad to hear about Bus Rapid Transit in the Inland Empire. Kudos on the name too: SBX. That sounds pretty edgy. Haha, guess I need to learn more about what’s going on out there. I’m glad to hear about Bus Rapid Transit in the Inland Empire. Kudos on the name too: SBX. That sounds pretty edgy.

]]> By: mattlos http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-50131 mattlos Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:13:34 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-50131 DJB -- SANBAG and Omni are hard at work on extending the Metrolink SBL to serve to the future San Bernardino Transit Center near the Carousel Mall http://www.pe.com/localnews/sbcounty/stories/PE_News_Local_S_sanbag04.3dde5b3.html DJB — SANBAG and Omni are hard at work on extending the Metrolink SBL to serve to the future San Bernardino Transit Center near the Carousel Mall

http://www.pe.com/localnews/sbcounty/stories/PE_News_Local_S_sanbag04.3dde5b3.html

]]> By: Justin N http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-50021 Justin N Wed, 18 Nov 2009 17:47:47 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-50021 I also wanted to mention that calwatch's suggestion is a good one. Many commuter rail systems do this- not only ACE, but West Coast Express in Vancouver, and GO Transit in Toronto. It allows for a substantially denser network, with improved off-peak service and late-night runs... I would LOVE to see Metrolink run late at night, even if it's a bus. I also wanted to mention that calwatch’s suggestion is a good one. Many commuter rail systems do this- not only ACE, but West Coast Express in Vancouver, and GO Transit in Toronto. It allows for a substantially denser network, with improved off-peak service and late-night runs… I would LOVE to see Metrolink run late at night, even if it’s a bus.

]]> By: Justin N http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-50011 Justin N Wed, 18 Nov 2009 17:44:17 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-50011 I wrote on my blog a while ago that what Metrolink needs out here in Inlandia is something similar to what Dan proposed- let holders of local bus passes ride for free within the territory of their bus pass. (I don't think this could be properly applied to Metro- their territory covers a LOT of Metrolink routes, and it would just cannibalize fare revenue.) The trains don't run empty, but they have a lot of excess capacity until they fill to the gills in eastern LA county (Pomona, Industry, Covina) or the northern O.C. (Anaheim, Orange). It'd be a benefit for Metrolink, because seats that were empty get filled, possibly attracting subsidies and no doubt getting paid by local transit agencies for the privilege, it'd benefit local transit riders by providing quick intra-regional service (which is pretty much nonexistent on the bus system out here- getting around along the I-10 corridor from Ontario to San Bernardino is ridiculous on the bus, but well-served by Metrolink), and it would encourage our transit operators to connect their services to Metrolink better than they currently do. Original post: http://ridinginriverside.blogspot.com/2009/08/on-bus-passes-and-empty-trains.html I wrote on my blog a while ago that what Metrolink needs out here in Inlandia is something similar to what Dan proposed- let holders of local bus passes ride for free within the territory of their bus pass. (I don’t think this could be properly applied to Metro- their territory covers a LOT of Metrolink routes, and it would just cannibalize fare revenue.) The trains don’t run empty, but they have a lot of excess capacity until they fill to the gills in eastern LA county (Pomona, Industry, Covina) or the northern O.C. (Anaheim, Orange).

It’d be a benefit for Metrolink, because seats that were empty get filled, possibly attracting subsidies and no doubt getting paid by local transit agencies for the privilege, it’d benefit local transit riders by providing quick intra-regional service (which is pretty much nonexistent on the bus system out here- getting around along the I-10 corridor from Ontario to San Bernardino is ridiculous on the bus, but well-served by Metrolink), and it would encourage our transit operators to connect their services to Metrolink better than they currently do.

Original post:
http://ridinginriverside.blogspot.com/2009/08/on-bus-passes-and-empty-trains.html

]]> By: Dan Wentzel http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-49981 Dan Wentzel Wed, 18 Nov 2009 16:49:21 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-49981 Once the Purple Line gets extended and the Regional Connector goes online I imagine Metrolink ridership will dramatically rise as there are places to connect to when you get to Union Station. It will be interesting to watch the Harbor Subdivision Transit Corridor extension project. Because of the Crenshaw project, it will no doubt be light rail hopefully offering a one-seat ride from downtown to LAX. It would be interesting to see if there could be a heavy rail connection there too so that Metrolink can run to LAX. I'm not sure it is wide enough for both heavy and light rail, but I imagine that will be studied. Once the Purple Line gets extended and the Regional Connector goes online I imagine Metrolink ridership will dramatically rise as there are places to connect to when you get to Union Station.

It will be interesting to watch the Harbor Subdivision Transit Corridor extension project. Because of the Crenshaw project, it will no doubt be light rail hopefully offering a one-seat ride from downtown to LAX. It would be interesting to see if there could be a heavy rail connection there too so that Metrolink can run to LAX. I’m not sure it is wide enough for both heavy and light rail, but I imagine that will be studied.

]]> By: Adonia http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-49971 Adonia Wed, 18 Nov 2009 16:36:48 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-49971 There is no shortage of riders on any of the trains I ride on the Orange County line. I usually purchase a Metrolink monthly pass to get between where I live in Koreatown and my school, UC Irvine. This lets me ride Amtrak trains in addition to Metrolink trains, along with being a Metro pass. This pass has enabled me to live carfree while commuting about 40 miles each way, since it is also quite easy to get a bike on the trains and I ride from the station to my campus. I agree that Metrolink could do a lot more in terms of ensuring connectivity, and advertising to local hubs that might send more commuters their way. Would a fare increase lead to my buying a car? Probably not, but from what I overhear on the train and what I know from talking to other commuters, I'm one of the few carfree people who rides. Any fare increases will probably send the car owners back to the freeways. There is no shortage of riders on any of the trains I ride on the Orange County line. I usually purchase a Metrolink monthly pass to get between where I live in Koreatown and my school, UC Irvine. This lets me ride Amtrak trains in addition to Metrolink trains, along with being a Metro pass. This pass has enabled me to live carfree while commuting about 40 miles each way, since it is also quite easy to get a bike on the trains and I ride from the station to my campus. I agree that Metrolink could do a lot more in terms of ensuring connectivity, and advertising to local hubs that might send more commuters their way. Would a fare increase lead to my buying a car? Probably not, but from what I overhear on the train and what I know from talking to other commuters, I’m one of the few carfree people who rides. Any fare increases will probably send the car owners back to the freeways.

]]> By: DJB http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-49961 DJB Wed, 18 Nov 2009 15:00:59 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-49961 There needs to be more dense development, both residential and office, around Metrolink stations. I've seen a couple projects going up along the San Bernardino line. The problem as usual is fragmented land use authority and local NIMBYism. Downtown San Bernardino could start by redeveloping that Carousel Mall parking lot, which seems to be far too large and acts as a barrier between the San Bernardino Metrolink station and Downtown San Bernardino. Put up a parking garage and a dense, mixed-use development. It'll have to wait for a better economy or a more progressive stimulus though. There needs to be more dense development, both residential and office, around Metrolink stations. I’ve seen a couple projects going up along the San Bernardino line. The problem as usual is fragmented land use authority and local NIMBYism.

Downtown San Bernardino could start by redeveloping that Carousel Mall parking lot, which seems to be far too large and acts as a barrier between the San Bernardino Metrolink station and Downtown San Bernardino. Put up a parking garage and a dense, mixed-use development.

It’ll have to wait for a better economy or a more progressive stimulus though.

]]> By: Spokker http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-49941 Spokker Wed, 18 Nov 2009 07:54:35 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-49941 Metrolink trains look empty sometimes but it can be deceptive. I would ride weekend trains on the OC Line and think I was one of ten people on the train, but once everybody gets off at Union Station the platform is very crowded from people getting off the train. I'm thinking, "Where the hell did these people come from?" Everybody complains about trains being half full but cars are often only a quarter full (1 driver, 3 empty passenger seats) and they clog up streets and highways. Looks like a lot of wasted capacity to me. Metrolink trains look empty sometimes but it can be deceptive. I would ride weekend trains on the OC Line and think I was one of ten people on the train, but once everybody gets off at Union Station the platform is very crowded from people getting off the train. I’m thinking, “Where the hell did these people come from?”

Everybody complains about trains being half full but cars are often only a quarter full (1 driver, 3 empty passenger seats) and they clog up streets and highways. Looks like a lot of wasted capacity to me.

]]> By: calwatch http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-49921 calwatch Wed, 18 Nov 2009 06:15:46 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-49921 Some folks won't like this, but lots of the midday, evening, and weekend service needs to be replaced by charter buses. Incidentally, costs are cheaper and it allows Metrolink to provide later service. This is similar to what Altamont Commuter Express does in lieu of running lightly patronized trains in the evening hour, or the Vallejo ferry. Rather than the last Metrolink leaving at 9 p.m., space the trains around a little (say, leaving at 5:40, 6:30, and 8:00 instead of 5:40, 6:00, 7:00, 8:00, and 9:00) and run a late bus at 9:00, 10:00, and 11:00. Yes it will take a little longer but it is dedicated service for Metrolink riders at Metrolink fares (with charter bus-level seats and comfort), making stops directly at Metrolink stations. Some folks won’t like this, but lots of the midday, evening, and weekend service needs to be replaced by charter buses. Incidentally, costs are cheaper and it allows Metrolink to provide later service. This is similar to what Altamont Commuter Express does in lieu of running lightly patronized trains in the evening hour, or the Vallejo ferry. Rather than the last Metrolink leaving at 9 p.m., space the trains around a little (say, leaving at 5:40, 6:30, and 8:00 instead of 5:40, 6:00, 7:00, 8:00, and 9:00) and run a late bus at 9:00, 10:00, and 11:00. Yes it will take a little longer but it is dedicated service for Metrolink riders at Metrolink fares (with charter bus-level seats and comfort), making stops directly at Metrolink stations.

]]> By: Spokker http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-49891 Spokker Wed, 18 Nov 2009 02:45:39 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-49891 And Amtrak will be running Metrolink trains soon, lol. And Amtrak will be running Metrolink trains soon, lol.

]]> By: Anonymous http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-49871 Anonymous Wed, 18 Nov 2009 01:01:28 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-49871 I've been on Metrolink trains, on the Burbank Airport line, arriving at Union Station late on a weekday morning, with fewer than 10 passengers. Though it was personally convenient for me, I have to wonder if there might be better uses of public funds than to operate every trip on Metrolink's current schedule. Certainly, a few mid-day trips can be justified--if commuters believe they have no way to get home if they should need to do so unexpectedly, they're more likely to drive--but perhaps their frequency can be decreased. Similarly, weekend service on the Orange County line could be better coordinated; I'd rather not have Metrolink duplicating service between Los Angeles and Oceanside that is already offered by Amtrak, especially when the connections to the south on NCTD's Coaster are timed to be impossible. (If New Jersey Transit and SEPTA can do through schedules and ticketing on the New York (Penn)-Trenton-Philadelphia route, why can't Metrolink and NCTD make it work here?) I understand there are lots of political issues to work out before any consolidation could occur, but does it really make sense to have three separate, publicly-subsidized passenger rail operators in southern California, each with their own set of overhead expenses? I’ve been on Metrolink trains, on the Burbank Airport line, arriving at Union Station late on a weekday morning, with fewer than 10 passengers. Though it was personally convenient for me, I have to wonder if there might be better uses of public funds than to operate every trip on Metrolink’s current schedule.

Certainly, a few mid-day trips can be justified–if commuters believe they have no way to get home if they should need to do so unexpectedly, they’re more likely to drive–but perhaps their frequency can be decreased.

Similarly, weekend service on the Orange County line could be better coordinated; I’d rather not have Metrolink duplicating service between Los Angeles and Oceanside that is already offered by Amtrak, especially when the connections to the south on NCTD’s Coaster are timed to be impossible. (If New Jersey Transit and SEPTA can do through schedules and ticketing on the New York (Penn)-Trenton-Philadelphia route, why can’t Metrolink and NCTD make it work here?)

I understand there are lots of political issues to work out before any consolidation could occur, but does it really make sense to have three separate, publicly-subsidized passenger rail operators in southern California, each with their own set of overhead expenses?

]]> By: Dan Wentzel http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-49851 Dan Wentzel Tue, 17 Nov 2009 23:39:16 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-49851 I wish communities and politicians in the east San Gabriel Valley, the north San Fernando Valley, and in Orange County would get more excited about double tracking Metrolink. In London, if you have a zone pass, you ride on any form of transit, including commuter rail, within the zones you paid for. It won't happen, but it would be great if there could be an intra-county pass that includes travel of Metrolink. If we had double tracking, we could have intra county short run trains as well. I wish communities and politicians in the east San Gabriel Valley, the north San Fernando Valley, and in Orange County would get more excited about double tracking Metrolink.

In London, if you have a zone pass, you ride on any form of transit, including commuter rail, within the zones you paid for.

It won’t happen, but it would be great if there could be an intra-county pass that includes travel of Metrolink. If we had double tracking, we could have intra county short run trains as well.

]]> By: Fred Camino, The Source http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-49841 Fred Camino, The Source Tue, 17 Nov 2009 23:23:48 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-49841 Today the Daily News suggested that Metrolink LOWER fares (http://www.dailynews.com/opinions/ci_13789704) to make the commuter rail a bargain and attract riders. Sounds like a good idea in theory, but it seems to me transit funding is like a box of Catch-22's inside a larger box of Catch-22's. Today the Daily News suggested that Metrolink LOWER fares (http://www.dailynews.com/opinions/ci_13789704) to make the commuter rail a bargain and attract riders. Sounds like a good idea in theory, but it seems to me transit funding is like a box of Catch-22′s inside a larger box of Catch-22′s.

]]> By: Spokker http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-49811 Spokker Tue, 17 Nov 2009 21:56:28 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-49811 If fares are not raised I fear there will be service cuts. While Metrolink does commuter rush hour rail service pretty well, it hurts regional connectivity if we cut the sparse midday and weekend trains we do have. Which hurts more? Service cuts or fare hikes? Who knows. If fares are not raised I fear there will be service cuts. While Metrolink does commuter rush hour rail service pretty well, it hurts regional connectivity if we cut the sparse midday and weekend trains we do have.

Which hurts more? Service cuts or fare hikes? Who knows.

]]> By: Mahatma http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/11/17/activism-success-metrolink-riders-convince-board-to-put-off-fare-hikes/comment-page-1/#comment-49771 Mahatma Tue, 17 Nov 2009 21:18:38 +0000 http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=21071#comment-49771 It's the most expensive fare-wise, but it's also the most highly subsidized service in the area....by far. Why keep pouring money into it? It’s the most expensive fare-wise, but it’s also the most highly subsidized service in the area….by far.

Why keep pouring money into it?

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