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	<title>Comments on: Holmby-Westwood Furious at Jack Weiss&#8217; Plan to Remove Traffic Calming</title>
	<atom:link href="http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/</link>
	<description>Covering Los Angeles&#039;s livable streets movement</description>
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		<title>By: TrafficCalmer</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5338</link>
		<dc:creator>TrafficCalmer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Apr 2009 04:10:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5338</guid>
		<description>Apparently Cheviot Hill doesn&#039;t have the same pull as Brentwood.

Today, there is no trace of the former Waterford exit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apparently Cheviot Hill doesn&#8217;t have the same pull as Brentwood.</p>
<p>Today, there is no trace of the former Waterford exit.</p>
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		<title>By: Gary Kavanagh</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5307</link>
		<dc:creator>Gary Kavanagh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 16:58:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5307</guid>
		<description>I highly recommend reading Tom Vanderbilt&#039;s book Traffic for some in depth explanations and research behind both traffic calming and how sometimes counter intuitively removing or limiting routes can actually benefit over all system efficiency.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I highly recommend reading Tom Vanderbilt&#8217;s book Traffic for some in depth explanations and research behind both traffic calming and how sometimes counter intuitively removing or limiting routes can actually benefit over all system efficiency.</p>
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		<title>By: ubrayj02</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5280</link>
		<dc:creator>ubrayj02</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 02:42:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5280</guid>
		<description>bzcat,

You are unwittingly employing a fallacy - traffic is not like water. It is possible to discourage auto trips over time by blocking its flow - you can&#039;t do the same with water in a river.

Here is an example:

You tear down a bridge that cars use to cross a gorge, replacing it with a foot bridge. The first day (or days) that the bridge is removed, people will show up with cars to cross the bridge. Pretty soon, however, all traffic will shift to the mode that allows travel across the gorge and/or traffic will decrease from its previous volume.

There is not a magical fixed amount of automobile traffic given a set density of human beings in an urban area. Automobile travel is induced by circumstances paid for, largely, by all of collectively in the form of taxes and fees that build our roads to serve automobiles.

Traffic calming DOES work, as it removes the ability to travel using a car in certain areas - thereby reducing the use of cars!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>bzcat,</p>
<p>You are unwittingly employing a fallacy &#8211; traffic is not like water. It is possible to discourage auto trips over time by blocking its flow &#8211; you can&#8217;t do the same with water in a river.</p>
<p>Here is an example:</p>
<p>You tear down a bridge that cars use to cross a gorge, replacing it with a foot bridge. The first day (or days) that the bridge is removed, people will show up with cars to cross the bridge. Pretty soon, however, all traffic will shift to the mode that allows travel across the gorge and/or traffic will decrease from its previous volume.</p>
<p>There is not a magical fixed amount of automobile traffic given a set density of human beings in an urban area. Automobile travel is induced by circumstances paid for, largely, by all of collectively in the form of taxes and fees that build our roads to serve automobiles.</p>
<p>Traffic calming DOES work, as it removes the ability to travel using a car in certain areas &#8211; thereby reducing the use of cars!</p>
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		<title>By: bzcat</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5271</link>
		<dc:creator>bzcat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 00:49:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5271</guid>
		<description>Umberto - yes I was awake when I typed that traffic calming is a load of crock. You can&#039;t discourage someone from using the road if that is the most logical access. All it accomplish is more gridlock and shift traffic to neighboring streets. I understand Streetblog is very anti-car so the idea that you can&#039;t change traffic pattern by building curb cutouts and signal timing is not a popular opinion here. I&#039;m a big believer in transit and better planning so I found myself in an odd position of arguing against traffic calming in LA. But that is because the way traffic calming is implemented in LA is counter productive. You can just rope off a neighborhood (like the city did with Holmby and Cheviot Hill) and do nothing about the underlying reason for the traffic - which in the case of Cheviot Hill - a frigging freeway off-ramp.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Umberto &#8211; yes I was awake when I typed that traffic calming is a load of crock. You can&#8217;t discourage someone from using the road if that is the most logical access. All it accomplish is more gridlock and shift traffic to neighboring streets. I understand Streetblog is very anti-car so the idea that you can&#8217;t change traffic pattern by building curb cutouts and signal timing is not a popular opinion here. I&#8217;m a big believer in transit and better planning so I found myself in an odd position of arguing against traffic calming in LA. But that is because the way traffic calming is implemented in LA is counter productive. You can just rope off a neighborhood (like the city did with Holmby and Cheviot Hill) and do nothing about the underlying reason for the traffic &#8211; which in the case of Cheviot Hill &#8211; a frigging freeway off-ramp.</p>
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		<title>By: bikinginla</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5219</link>
		<dc:creator>bikinginla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 03:24:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5219</guid>
		<description>Hasn&#039;t Weiss done enough damage? I hope people remember things like this when they vote for city attorney — and when they vote for Jack&#039;s replacement on the council, which can&#039;t come soon enough.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hasn&#8217;t Weiss done enough damage? I hope people remember things like this when they vote for city attorney — and when they vote for Jack&#8217;s replacement on the council, which can&#8217;t come soon enough.</p>
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		<title>By: Phred</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5217</link>
		<dc:creator>Phred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 03:20:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5217</guid>
		<description>This is payback time for Jack Weiss. Payback to his donors, the developers from whom he needs more money for his current campaign, and payback to his constituents who despise him because of the many other times he has &quot;had his way&quot; with them. And he needs to get this done soon, because in a couple of months he will be out of the City council and will no longer have the power to do it. That&#039;s why all his pet projects are being fast-tracked: Museum of Tolerance Party Center, Pico/Olympic branch of the 10 Freeway, the routing of the Subway to the Sea, you name it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is payback time for Jack Weiss. Payback to his donors, the developers from whom he needs more money for his current campaign, and payback to his constituents who despise him because of the many other times he has &#8220;had his way&#8221; with them. And he needs to get this done soon, because in a couple of months he will be out of the City council and will no longer have the power to do it. That&#8217;s why all his pet projects are being fast-tracked: Museum of Tolerance Party Center, Pico/Olympic branch of the 10 Freeway, the routing of the Subway to the Sea, you name it.</p>
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		<title>By: Umberto Brayj</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5212</link>
		<dc:creator>Umberto Brayj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 00:47:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5212</guid>
		<description>I guess I see you point KateNonymous, but this is so incredibly blatant ... I mean, wow, he is just doing the exact opposite of what a large group of his own constituents want. I bet he&#039;s the one who had the DOT screw around with their implementation of the Neighborhood Protection Plan.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I guess I see you point KateNonymous, but this is so incredibly blatant &#8230; I mean, wow, he is just doing the exact opposite of what a large group of his own constituents want. I bet he&#8217;s the one who had the DOT screw around with their implementation of the Neighborhood Protection Plan.</p>
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		<title>By: KateNonymous</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5211</link>
		<dc:creator>KateNonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 00:22:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5211</guid>
		<description>@ubrayj02, when has Jack Weiss NOT been the handmaiden of developers? I&#039;m not sure he knows he has other constituents.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ubrayj02, when has Jack Weiss NOT been the handmaiden of developers? I&#8217;m not sure he knows he has other constituents.</p>
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		<title>By: Umberto Brayj</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5209</link>
		<dc:creator>Umberto Brayj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 23:35:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5209</guid>
		<description>Additonally, bzcat, traffic calming is supposed to make things worse for cars. It is supposed to slow them down and discourage their use. Are you even awake when you type?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Additonally, bzcat, traffic calming is supposed to make things worse for cars. It is supposed to slow them down and discourage their use. Are you even awake when you type?</p>
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		<title>By: Umberto Brayj</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5208</link>
		<dc:creator>Umberto Brayj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 23:34:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5208</guid>
		<description>bzcat - traffic calming is a load of crap? WTF?

Your anecdotal evidence is weak.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>bzcat &#8211; traffic calming is a load of crap? WTF?</p>
<p>Your anecdotal evidence is weak.</p>
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		<title>By: Mill</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5205</link>
		<dc:creator>Mill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 23:01:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5205</guid>
		<description>Ummm, how do you reduce traffic by 124.3%?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ummm, how do you reduce traffic by 124.3%?</p>
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		<title>By: bzcat</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5203</link>
		<dc:creator>bzcat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 22:46:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5203</guid>
		<description>Traffic calming is a load of crock anyway. All it does is shuffle cars from one street to another without changing the underlying traffic pattern. Just look at the traffic calming project at Cheviot Hill - instead of reducing traffic, all it accomplished is increased gridlock at Pico/Motor and National/Motor. The statistic shows that the number of vehicle trips through Cheviot Hill didn&#039;t change very much. And my personal experience is that the amount of time one spends on Motor on the way to I-10 has increased dramatically. So basically, traffic calming didn&#039;t solve the traffic problem, it just made one&#039;s transit time through the neighborhood much longer. It&#039;s thick with irony.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Traffic calming is a load of crock anyway. All it does is shuffle cars from one street to another without changing the underlying traffic pattern. Just look at the traffic calming project at Cheviot Hill &#8211; instead of reducing traffic, all it accomplished is increased gridlock at Pico/Motor and National/Motor. The statistic shows that the number of vehicle trips through Cheviot Hill didn&#8217;t change very much. And my personal experience is that the amount of time one spends on Motor on the way to I-10 has increased dramatically. So basically, traffic calming didn&#8217;t solve the traffic problem, it just made one&#8217;s transit time through the neighborhood much longer. It&#8217;s thick with irony.</p>
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		<title>By: ubrayj02</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5201</link>
		<dc:creator>ubrayj02</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 21:59:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5201</guid>
		<description>Props to whoever put this together:
http://clkrep.lacity.org/onlinedocs/2007/07-3905-S1_misc_4-6-09.pdf

Man, is Jack Wiess the handmaiden of the developers of this project or something? Do they have pictures of him making out with a donkey? Why would he so directly try and screw his own constituents. Pre-interwebnets era, he might have gotten away with it - but having access to these documents show that this move on his part is ridiculous.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Props to whoever put this together:<br />
<a href="http://clkrep.lacity.org/onlinedocs/2007/07-3905-S1_misc_4-6-09.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://clkrep.lacity.org/onlinedocs/2007/07-3905-S1_misc_4-6-09.pdf</a></p>
<p>Man, is Jack Wiess the handmaiden of the developers of this project or something? Do they have pictures of him making out with a donkey? Why would he so directly try and screw his own constituents. Pre-interwebnets era, he might have gotten away with it &#8211; but having access to these documents show that this move on his part is ridiculous.</p>
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		<title>By: ubrayj02</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5200</link>
		<dc:creator>ubrayj02</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 21:37:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5200</guid>
		<description>From the motion before the Tansportaiton Committee:
&lt;blockquote&gt;&quot;DOT&#039;s policy for determining whether traffic restrictions should be implemented includes a consideration for whether there is super-majority community support for such restrictions. Hence, at the request of DOT, the City Clerk&#039;s Office mailed out opinion survey forms and related information to every residence within a designated affected area, asking if the occupants supported the proposed NTM Plan. Based upon the responses returned to the City Clerk, DOT has determined the implementation of permanent restrictions did not meet DOT established thresholds for community support.&quot;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I&#039;d say &quot;straight from the horse&#039;s mouth&quot;, but this looks like it came from the other end.

The DOT determines what &quot;the community&quot; is, and when their &quot;community&quot; doesn&#039;t respond with 67% in favor of slowing down cars they want cars to flow at maximum speeds in a residential area.

The DOT&#039;s policy is based on NOTHING - there is nothing behind it other than &quot;DOT policy&quot;. F&amp;*k DOT policy. What is wrong with the mayor? Didn&#039;t he lobby hard with wealthy jews in L.A. to get his job? Doesn&#039;t he owe these folks calmer streets and a healthier climate for business? This department acts like its own little caliphate, and the people who pay for its existence are serfs who need to get back to threshing wheat for its coffers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From the motion before the Tansportaiton Committee:</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;DOT&#8217;s policy for determining whether traffic restrictions should be implemented includes a consideration for whether there is super-majority community support for such restrictions. Hence, at the request of DOT, the City Clerk&#8217;s Office mailed out opinion survey forms and related information to every residence within a designated affected area, asking if the occupants supported the proposed NTM Plan. Based upon the responses returned to the City Clerk, DOT has determined the implementation of permanent restrictions did not meet DOT established thresholds for community support.&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<p>I&#8217;d say &#8220;straight from the horse&#8217;s mouth&#8221;, but this looks like it came from the other end.</p>
<p>The DOT determines what &#8220;the community&#8221; is, and when their &#8220;community&#8221; doesn&#8217;t respond with 67% in favor of slowing down cars they want cars to flow at maximum speeds in a residential area.</p>
<p>The DOT&#8217;s policy is based on NOTHING &#8211; there is nothing behind it other than &#8220;DOT policy&#8221;. F&amp;*k DOT policy. What is wrong with the mayor? Didn&#8217;t he lobby hard with wealthy jews in L.A. to get his job? Doesn&#8217;t he owe these folks calmer streets and a healthier climate for business? This department acts like its own little caliphate, and the people who pay for its existence are serfs who need to get back to threshing wheat for its coffers.</p>
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		<title>By: ubrayj02</title>
		<link>http://la.streetsblog.org/2009/04/07/holmby-westwood-furious-at-jack-weiss-plan-to-remove-traffic-calming/comment-page-1/#comment-5198</link>
		<dc:creator>ubrayj02</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 21:25:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://la.streetsblog.org/?p=1974#comment-5198</guid>
		<description>Dude - WTF?! How can this happen in the Mayor&#039;s &quot;Green LA&quot;? What a crock. Who do we call/write letters to to stop the insanity?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dude &#8211; WTF?! How can this happen in the Mayor&#8217;s &#8220;Green LA&#8221;? What a crock. Who do we call/write letters to to stop the insanity?</p>
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